Category: InterviewCategory: Interview

Had a great time talking with Claire Venus via Substack Live. We covered a lot in this hour long chat!

Substack’s platform features and distractions: We talk about the increasing features on Substack, like Notes and video, which creates an “attention economy,” which is often times what we’re trying to avoid!

The value of an Email List: Direct access to your audience is so important, and very much worth the time and energy.

Monetization and payments: The challenge in asking for payment, and exploring options like “Buy Me a Coffee” buttons instead of paid subscriptions.

Hosting your own Zoom calls!

Connecting beyond vanity metrics: We talked about building genuine connections with readers and other writers through personal outreach, and small gatherings, and how that can be more valuable than viral hits or ranking on arbitrary leaderboards.

Tenacity in reaching readers: Not all subscribers see every post or email, so it’s necessary to employ “creative bothering” (thanks Cody Cook-Parrott) and talk about your offering more than once to make sure your message reaches your audience.

Are you prepared for more people to find out about your work?

Is your bio photo current? Is your online store stocked? Can people sign up for your email list? Has your welcome email been updated since 2024? Is your website set up in a way that people would stick around and find out more about you, or are all your most engaging videos sitting on other platforms?

In my recent talk with Laura Kidd of Penfriend (new album ‘House Of Stories’ is out April 18th), we hit on the subject of “virality” and the pursuit of more.

“I think people get so blinded by virality and like if somebody doesn’t have 32,000 views on YouTube or something, nothing’s ever going to happen. But yes, my full-time income comes mostly from 236 subscribers on Patreon. and it’s topped up by music sales and stuff I put out on Bandcamp, pay what you want and stuff, and people choose to pay. So it seems small. Maybe it seems small. To me, I know it’s not small. Seven and a half thousand maybe seems small, but if you’ve ever tried to build an email list, you probably know it’s not small. But those people can give you a job if you are able to find… what that job should be, I suppose, what they will value and adds to their life and adds to your own creative practice and everything.”

Listen to the full podcast episode here:

More people on your email list won’t matter if you’re not providing them some form of “value.” Sorry to sound so capitalist, but I mean, in exchange for a reader’s time and energy of opening the email, are you providing entertainment? Relief? Wisdom? Hope? Good music?

Because if you’re not doing that for the people right in front of you, what makes you think you can do it for 5,000 more?

In the video above, Laura talks about having 236 Patreon supporters out of 7,500 email subscribers, which means that “just” 3.1% are enough to earn a living (in addition to music sales).

Depending on what you do, 7,500 is attainable. We’re all closer to 7,500 than a million, right? And 236? I like that number even more.

So cherish the 20 or so people on your email list today, because they’re your foundation.

Stop worrying about all the new people out there that have no idea who you are, and focus on the few dozen people who care enough to open your emails and click play on your videos.

“The false proxy of how many people are following you on social media is a trap,” says Seth Godin, “I know people who have gotten 40 million views of a TikTok, and sold $200 worth of stuff to go with it.”

I offer Email Guidance, where I provide affordable, personalized thoughts and ideas to use and think about for your project. I don’t need 40 million people to know about this offer. My email list will do just fine, really. I can pay the rent without this newsletter getting a million views (find out more here).

And maybe you don’t need to get your work in a fancy art gallery, or play a big corporate owned music venue. Maybe you don’t need to get picked by whatever gatekeeper exists in your world, and you can just do whatever you want.

What’s at the core of what you want to do, and how are you building that foundation today?

Where’s the biggest joy you find? How can you skip all the busy work you don’t want to do and still achieve your desired outcome?

Get on Laura’s email list here: https://penfriend.rocks/hello

Get Laura’s music on Bandcamp!

As you can see, Olivia and I had a horrible conversation about quitting Spotify, making an album about geology, and lots more.

This was recorded on Substack Live, so some things you might here throughout are usually reactions to people making comments during the live stream.

Subscribe to the full podcast RSS feed here.

Substack is a busy place these days, and I’m definitely taking full advantage of the Live functionality to talk to interesting people.

Last Monday I got talking to 

Chuck Marshall. I didn’t leave that call thinking about NEW SUBSCRIBERS or engagement, but rather, “wow, Chuck is a cool guy, I’m glad we got to chat!”

Little did I know that magic would happen afterwards.

This from 

Bree Stilwell:

All these fricking live videos lately, it’s just soooo much. When I saw Seth Werkheiser pop in though, while folding laundry and feeling loose, gave it a shot.

What happened next is exactly why I think most of us are here, fighting our way through the noise and toward real life connections with other creatives.

I watched this video, learned a little about this cool dude and his local music, arts and beer newsletter, and, that we live in the same town.

I dm’d immediately, met him and his amazing partner-in-all-things Brenda for coffee just days later, and the bond has been set. Good works to follow, and friendships I didn’t have last week.

Says Chuck in his latest post:

“We met on Friday morning for coffee over at York Food and Drink. Meeting Bree and talking about her background and passion for art was a blast. She also shared thoughts on her project, which is yet another source of inspiration. She’s looking to build a third space for all kinds of creative folks. Most importantly, including those that are what I’ll call ‘creative curious.’”

This is what I’m talking about, friends; use the internet as a tool, not a destination.

As Bree said in a follow up comment, “it’s so completely crucial to use this platform, and others like it, as peripheral tools to make shit happen in real life, in our communities, and for lasting effect.”

If that takes shape as a Zoom room or a supper club or an email thread, then do it. Make sure it’s sustainable, and it feels good, with the right people.

Ditch the social media feeds and their algorithmic grief machines, and just fill your day with good people instead.